greetings

[Hermine Strand]

Not autistic myself, but sympathetic and willing to learn. Research is
important!

[Bob Badour]

Post by Hermine Strand
Not autistic myself, but sympathetic and willing to learn. Research is
important!

Not a spammer myself, but unsympathetic and unwilling to learn. I agree
that research is important. Spam is not.

[d***@fsmail.net]

> Not autistic myself, but sympathetic and willing to learn. Research is
> important!
Not a spammer myself, but unsympathetic and unwilling to learn. I agree
that research is important. Spam is not.

It is not spam. The website link is a way for Hermine to tell us a bit about himself. It seems sensible to me; it is quicker than writing an introduction.

Dolphinius
(Male, age 40 +/- a few months, UK, self-diagnosed AS)

[Aquarian Monkey]

Post by Hermine Strand
Not autistic myself, but sympathetic and willing to learn. Research is
important!
--
Hermine Strand
Author
http://earthatory.wordpress.com

In the event that you are, indeed, researching and willing to learn, welcome!

You will be best suited by asking specific questions about the things you are curious about. The group has been very quiet as of late, for the most part, but it is possible that some might be lured into participation if you are what you say you are...a person who would really like to learn. There are many people who pop by here on occasion who have a lot of wisdom to share and are very eloquent in their ability to share it.

I, myself, am not on the spectrum, but I have two kids who are. This group of people has been instrumental in helping me learn how best to support them.

[Bob Badour]

Post by Aquarian Monkey

Post by Hermine Strand
Not autistic myself, but sympathetic and willing to learn. Research is
important!
--
Hermine Strand
Author
http://<redacted>
<redacted>

In the event that you are, indeed, researching and willing to learn, welcome!
You will be best suited by asking specific questions about the things you are curious about. The group has been very quiet as of late, for the most part, but it is possible that some might be lured into participation if you are what you say you are...a person who would really like to learn. There are many people who pop by here on occasion who have a lot of wisdom to share and are very eloquent in their ability to share it.
I, myself, am not on the spectrum, but I have two kids who are. This group of people has been instrumental in helping me learn how best to support them.

When you reply to spammers, please delete the links they are
advertising. Otherwise, you only reward them with link love for spamming us.

[Hermine Strand]

If my signature is an issue for people, I can remove the website link, but
my email address stays.

Please start me off very slowly. What do you mean by "spectrum?" If you have
links to save time, feel free to provide them.

Post by Hermine Strand
Not autistic myself, but sympathetic and willing to learn. Research is
important!
--
Hermine Strand
Author
http://earthatory.wordpress.com

In the event that you are, indeed, researching and willing to learn,
welcome!

You will be best suited by asking specific questions about the things you
are curious about. The group has been very quiet as of late, for the most
part, but it is possible that some might be lured into participation if you
are what you say you are...a person who would really like to learn. There
are many people who pop by here on occasion who have a lot of wisdom to
share and are very eloquent in their ability to share it.

I, myself, am not on the spectrum, but I have two kids who are. This group
of people has been instrumental in helping me learn how best to support
them.

[Bob Badour]

Post by Hermine Strand
If my signature is an issue for people, I can remove the website link, but
my email address stays.
Please start me off very slowly. What do you mean by "spectrum?" If you have
links to save time, feel free to provide them.

Classic kanner autism is one of many pervasive developmental disorders
that share common traits and that span a broad spectrum (across a couple
dimensions). At one extreme, there are people with immeasurably low IQ
who perhaps never learn to speak. At another extreme are Fields
Medalists who have Aspergers or PDD-NOS.

The spectrum has been divided up into rather arbitrary categories. The
difference between autism and aspergers relates to language delays in
early childhood; although, it's not entirely clear that adult auties and
aspies have any real differences.

Autistics also get divided rather arbitrarily into "high functioning"
and "low functioning"; although, folks will often disagree on exactly
what "functioning" means. And many of us function very well in some
aspects of our lives and very poorly in others.

Because autism is genetic in origin, the parents of autistics often have
measurable differences in executive function, for example, while not
meeting diagnostic criteria for any developmental delay. This is often
referred to as the "broader autism phenotype" and places these parents
on the edge of the spectrum.

If you are not a spammer, then apparently, you are a novelist
researching characters.

If you have not already done so, I suggest you go to google groups and
look at the archives of our discussions and of our play here. I think
you will get better research material than by just showing up and asking
basic questions one can easily answer with a google search.

Post by Hermine Strand

Post by Hermine Strand
Not autistic myself, but sympathetic and willing to learn. Research is
important!
--
Hermine Strand
Author
http://earthatory.wordpress.com

In the event that you are, indeed, researching and willing to learn, welcome!
You will be best suited by asking specific questions about the things you
are curious about. The group has been very quiet as of late, for the most
part, but it is possible that some might be lured into participation if you
are what you say you are...a person who would really like to learn. There
are many people who pop by here on occasion who have a lot of wisdom to
share and are very eloquent in their ability to share it.
I, myself, am not on the spectrum, but I have two kids who are. This group
of people has been instrumental in helping me learn how best to support
them.

[Aquarian Monkey]

What do you mean by &quot;spectrum?&quot;

Well, one thing I think you should know about the "spectrum"--or the wide range of ways in which autism can present--is that some people learn to "pass." What is meant by this, IMHO, is that the person learns enough compensatory strategies to "fake" being NT (neurotypical) for a period of time. While this initially seems like it would be a good thing, and in some respects it is, in other respects it causes serious issues for the people who do it. I will leave the first-person explanation of how that is to the people here who are actually on the spectrum and instead explain how this plays out for my kids.

They seem normal enough.

Most of the time.

And most of the time they can be expected to behave like many kids their age, give or take a few eccentricities.

The problem happens because even though they may "appear" to be like their peers, they are not. And sometimes people hold expectations of them that are simply not reasonable, and so they are doomed to fail. Or, for another example, sometimes when they are having a hard time compensating, their behavior may deteriorate and I will tell you, they look like spoiled brats when it happens. The problem is, they are not spoiled brats; they are very well behaved kids. And some people pass judgment on them for this, which is horribly unfair because it is something that they have very little control over. In this regard I have often felt like the challenges my kids face in this area rival the challenges of kids who are more recognizably impaired. My son has been bullied at school and I am certain it is because he has no readily apparent disability, so there is no taboo against bullying him. He is just a remarkably easy target because of his deficits. If he were more obviously impaired, I think kids would be less likely to bully him because there would be peer pressure not to. I also think that both of my kids would be "cut more slack" if they were more obviously impaired. And sometimes, they really need that "slack."

It is still difficult to understand what kind of information you are looking for. Autism is a huge topic. It took me probably 2 years to accumulate enough information to fully "get it" and I was the highly motivated parent of a little girl who desperately needed my understanding. If I could guide you in one direction, it would be away from books/blogs written by parents and toward books/blogs written by aspies and auties. It's not that the parent-written books/blogs are not worthwhile, I just think that learning the non-NT perspective first leaves you with a broader point of view. After all, you already know how NT people think, assuming you are one, which might not be a fair assumption.

[Phil W Lee]

Post by Aquarian Monkey

What do you mean by &quot;spectrum?&quot;

Well, one thing I think you should know about the "spectrum"--or the wide range of ways in which autism can present--is that some people learn to "pass." What is meant by this, IMHO, is that the person learns enough compensatory strategies to "fake" being NT (neurotypical) for a period of time. While this initially seems like it would be a good thing, and in some respects it is, in other respects it causes serious issues for the people who do it. I will leave the first-person explanation of how that is to the people here who are actually on the spectrum and instead explain how this plays out for my kids.
They seem normal enough.
Most of the time.
And most of the time they can be expected to behave like many kids their age, give or take a few eccentricities.
The problem happens because even though they may "appear" to be like their peers, they are not. And sometimes people hold expectations of them that are simply not reasonable, and so they are doomed to fail. Or, for another example, sometimes when they are having a hard time compensating, their behavior may deteriorate and I will tell you, they look like spoiled brats when it happens. The problem is, they are not spoiled brats; they are very well behaved kids. And some people pass judgment on them for this, which is horribly unfair because it is something that they have very little control over. In this regard I have often felt like the challenges my kids face in this area rival the challenges of kids who are more recognizably impaired. My son has been bullied at school and I am certain it is because he has no readily apparent disability, so there is no taboo against bullying him. He is just a remarkably easy target because of his deficits. If he were more obviously impaired, I think
kids would be less likely to bully him because there would be peer pressure not to. I also think that both of my kids would be "cut more slack" if they were more obviously impaired. And sometimes, they really need that "slack."
It is still difficult to understand what kind of information you are looking for. Autism is a huge topic. It took me probably 2 years to accumulate enough information to fully "get it" and I was the highly motivated parent of a little girl who desperately needed my understanding. If I could guide you in one direction, it would be away from books/blogs written by parents and toward books/blogs written by aspies and auties. It's not that the parent-written books/blogs are not worthwhile, I just think that learning the non-NT perspective first leaves you with a broader point of view. After all, you already know how NT people think, assuming you are one, which might not be a fair assumption.

Consider someone trying to live their life as if they were a marathon
runner, but without the actual fitness or stamina to actually run a
marathon.
They could dress the part, they could be seen running around, over
short distances.
But if you actually make then run a marathon, they will collapse.
Time off in between short periods of acting the part will be essential
for recovery from the effort.

Now, that obviously isn't a direct comparison - the stress is mental
and emotional more than physical - but it might give some idea of the
effort required to appear normal, and the need for recovery between
efforts.
Just to add to that, many of us are not very good at recognising when
we are reaching out limits, so can easily exceed them. That is one
reason (although I'm sure others will come up with more) why so many
of us rely on routines - if you lack the ability to say "I'll run
until I get tired" you have to work out over time how long you can run
for and stick to that, so stopping doing %whatever% after the standard
time is the only way of ensuring that you don't overdo it.

That is only one aspect, of course. There are many others.

[Hermine Strand]

I just wanted to give everybody a group thank-you for being so helpful. Yes,
I'm sure that the people who are autistic and Aspies are a much better
source of information on their self-experience than those observing them
from the outside. I tend to write third-person stuff and detest
autobiographica and self-revelatory writing, but I love getting into the
minds of my heroines in third person as long as they are totally different
people from me.

No, I don't appear to be autistic. Long road to go before I'm comfortable
writing something that incorporates an autistic person's perspective. My
favorite novel by another independent author is actually first-person,
written from the perspective of a disturbingly stupid neurotypical woman,
but the novel is quite intelligent thanks to dialogue by smarter people and
just the way the heroine's internals are presented.

Special thanks to Bob for giving me the benefit of the doubt. Off I go to
google stuff as he suggested. You never did say if including my website link
in a signature is an issue.

Post by Phil W Lee

Post by Aquarian Monkey

What do you mean by &quot;spectrum?&quot;

Well, one thing I think you should know about the "spectrum"--or the wide
range of ways in which autism can present--is that some people learn to
"pass." What is meant by this, IMHO, is that the person learns enough
compensatory strategies to "fake" being NT (neurotypical) for a period of
time. While this initially seems like it would be a good thing, and in
some respects it is, in other respects it causes serious issues for the
people who do it. I will leave the first-person explanation of how that is
to the people here who are actually on the spectrum and instead explain
how this plays out for my kids.
They seem normal enough.
Most of the time.
And most of the time they can be expected to behave like many kids their
age, give or take a few eccentricities.
The problem happens because even though they may "appear" to be like their
peers, they are not. And sometimes people hold expectations of them that
are simply not reasonable, and so they are doomed to fail. Or, for another
example, sometimes when they are having a hard time compensating, their
behavior may deteriorate and I will tell you, they look like spoiled brats
when it happens. The problem is, they are not spoiled brats; they are very
well behaved kids. And some people pass judgment on them for this, which
is horribly unfair because it is something that they have very little
control over. In this regard I have often felt like the challenges my kids
face in this area rival the challenges of kids who are more recognizably
impaired. My son has been bullied at school and I am certain it is because
he has no readily apparent disability, so there is no taboo against
bullying him. He is just a remarkably easy target because of his deficits.
If he were more obviously impaired, I think
kids would be less likely to bully him because there would be peer
pressure not to. I also think that both of my kids would be "cut more
slack" if they were more obviously impaired. And sometimes, they really
need that "slack."
It is still difficult to understand what kind of information you are
looking for. Autism is a huge topic. It took me probably 2 years to
accumulate enough information to fully "get it" and I was the highly
motivated parent of a little girl who desperately needed my understanding.
If I could guide you in one direction, it would be away from books/blogs
written by parents and toward books/blogs written by aspies and auties.
It's not that the parent-written books/blogs are not worthwhile, I just
think that learning the non-NT perspective first leaves you with a broader
point of view. After all, you already know how NT people think, assuming
you are one, which might not be a fair assumption.

Consider someone trying to live their life as if they were a marathon
runner, but without the actual fitness or stamina to actually run a
marathon.
They could dress the part, they could be seen running around, over
short distances.
But if you actually make then run a marathon, they will collapse.
Time off in between short periods of acting the part will be essential
for recovery from the effort.
Now, that obviously isn't a direct comparison - the stress is mental
and emotional more than physical - but it might give some idea of the
effort required to appear normal, and the need for recovery between
efforts.
Just to add to that, many of us are not very good at recognising when
we are reaching out limits, so can easily exceed them. That is one
reason (although I'm sure others will come up with more) why so many
of us rely on routines - if you lack the ability to say "I'll run
until I get tired" you have to work out over time how long you can run
for and stick to that, so stopping doing %whatever% after the standard
time is the only way of ensuring that you don't overdo it.
That is only one aspect, of course. There are many others.

[d***@fsmail.net]

Post by Hermine Strand
I just wanted to give everybody a group thank-you for being so helpful. Yes,
I'm sure that the people who are autistic and Aspies are a much better
source of information on their self-experience than those observing them
from the outside. I tend to write third-person stuff and detest
autobiographica and self-revelatory writing, but I love getting into the
minds of my heroines in third person as long as they are totally different
people from me.

My experience of female Aspies I have encountered is that they don't have much natural empathy (like Aspie males), but they are typically more social and make more of an effort to compensate for lack of empathy. They quickly learn the rules of how they shold behave and try to apply them. They try to cultivate female friendships. They seem quite good at it too.

I am struggling though to think of a female Aspie I know who I would think of as a heroine. All of them like a degree of routine.

Post by Hermine Strand
No, I don't appear to be autistic. Long road to go before I'm comfortable
writing something that incorporates an autistic person's perspective. My
favorite novel by another independent author is actually first-person,
written from the perspective of a disturbingly stupid neurotypical woman,
but the novel is quite intelligent thanks to dialogue by smarter people and
just the way the heroine's internals are presented.
Special thanks to Bob for giving me the benefit of the doubt. Off I go to
google stuff as he suggested. You never did say if including my website link
in a signature is an issue.

I think it's sometimes OK to ask things you can find out about on Google, especially if you want the perspective of living people in the here and now.

Dolphinius
(Male, age 40 +/- a few months, self-diagnosed AS)

[Bob Badour]

Post by Hermine Strand
I just wanted to give everybody a group thank-you for being so helpful. Yes,
I'm sure that the people who are autistic and Aspies are a much better
source of information on their self-experience than those observing them
from the outside. I tend to write third-person stuff and detest
autobiographica and self-revelatory writing, but I love getting into the
minds of my heroines in third person as long as they are totally different
people from me.
No, I don't appear to be autistic. Long road to go before I'm comfortable
writing something that incorporates an autistic person's perspective. My
favorite novel by another independent author is actually first-person,
written from the perspective of a disturbingly stupid neurotypical woman,
but the novel is quite intelligent thanks to dialogue by smarter people and
just the way the heroine's internals are presented.
Special thanks to Bob for giving me the benefit of the doubt. Off I go to
google stuff as he suggested. You never did say if including my website link
in a signature is an issue.

Once you have been here long enough to get recognized as a regular and
so the regulars recognize you and what you are about, you will be able
to introduce a signature with a link without anyone paying any attention.

A short introductory post that consists entirely of generalities that
could apply to any group by replacing a single word that has a back link
to a completely unrelated site looks like spam.

While it doesn't take long to get accepted as a regular, I suggest
waiting a bit before re-introducing a link to your site.

Post by Hermine Strand

Post by Phil W Lee

Post by Aquarian Monkey

What do you mean by &quot;spectrum?&quot;

Well, one thing I think you should know about the "spectrum"--or the wide
range of ways in which autism can present--is that some people learn to
"pass." What is meant by this, IMHO, is that the person learns enough
compensatory strategies to "fake" being NT (neurotypical) for a period of
time. While this initially seems like it would be a good thing, and in
some respects it is, in other respects it causes serious issues for the
people who do it. I will leave the first-person explanation of how that is
to the people here who are actually on the spectrum and instead explain
how this plays out for my kids.
They seem normal enough.
Most of the time.
And most of the time they can be expected to behave like many kids their
age, give or take a few eccentricities.
The problem happens because even though they may "appear" to be like their
peers, they are not. And sometimes people hold expectations of them that
are simply not reasonable, and so they are doomed to fail. Or, for another
example, sometimes when they are having a hard time compensating, their
behavior may deteriorate and I will tell you, they look like spoiled brats
when it happens. The problem is, they are not spoiled brats; they are very
well behaved kids. And some people pass judgment on them for this, which
is horribly unfair because it is something that they have very little
control over. In this regard I have often felt like the challenges my kids
face in this area rival the challenges of kids who are more recognizably
impaired. My son has been bullied at school and I am certain it is because
he has no readily apparent disability, so there is no taboo against
bullying him. He is just a remarkably easy target because of his deficits.
If he were more obviously impaired, I think
kids would be less likely to bully him because there would be peer
pressure not to. I also think that both of my kids would be "cut more
slack" if they were more obviously impaired. And sometimes, they really
need that "slack."
It is still difficult to understand what kind of information you are
looking for. Autism is a huge topic. It took me probably 2 years to
accumulate enough information to fully "get it" and I was the highly
motivated parent of a little girl who desperately needed my understanding.
If I could guide you in one direction, it would be away from books/blogs
written by parents and toward books/blogs written by aspies and auties.
It's not that the parent-written books/blogs are not worthwhile, I just
think that learning the non-NT perspective first leaves you with a broader
point of view. After all, you already know how NT people think, assuming
you are one, which might not be a fair assumption.

Consider someone trying to live their life as if they were a marathon
runner, but without the actual fitness or stamina to actually run a
marathon.
They could dress the part, they could be seen running around, over
short distances.
But if you actually make then run a marathon, they will collapse.
Time off in between short periods of acting the part will be essential
for recovery from the effort.
Now, that obviously isn't a direct comparison - the stress is mental
and emotional more than physical - but it might give some idea of the
effort required to appear normal, and the need for recovery between
efforts.
Just to add to that, many of us are not very good at recognising when
we are reaching out limits, so can easily exceed them. That is one
reason (although I'm sure others will come up with more) why so many
of us rely on routines - if you lack the ability to say "I'll run
until I get tired" you have to work out over time how long you can run
for and stick to that, so stopping doing %whatever% after the standard
time is the only way of ensuring that you don't overdo it.
That is only one aspect, of course. There are many others.

[toto]

On Tue, 24 Jul 2012 10:23:18 -0400, "Hermine Strand"

Post by Hermine Strand
If my signature is an issue for people, I can remove the website link, but
my email address stays.
Please start me off very slowly. What do you mean by "spectrum?" If you have
links to save time, feel free to provide them.

If you are serious, I would not put a *real* email out here on usenet.
This is a different kind of world and you will note that many people
do not post with valid email addys.

My own is entirely bogus. The problem with using real emails on
usenet is the number of trolls who then have your real email and the
amount of spam. I used to post with a regular email back when I
started. I learned not to from people on various groups.

Autism is a spectrum meaning basically that each autistic person is
different and will have different symptoms, problems and strengths.

If you want to meet parents of autistic children, there are not that
many on this forum, though there are a few. I am a grandmother of an
autistic boy who is 8 and a girl who is 10 with asperger's syndrome.

In this forum, you will meet adult autistic people who can teach you a
lot about autism.

[d***@fsmail.net]

Post by Hermine Strand
Not autistic myself, but sympathetic and willing to learn. Research is
important!
--
Hermine Strand
Author

Hello Hermine.

I understand that authors need to research subjects they want to write about and if that's what you're here to do that's fine by me. Whatever has brought you here, welcome! I'd encourage you to ask anything you want and join in the discussions, or start new ones.

Dolphinius
(Male, age 40 +/- a few months, UK, self-diagnosed AS)

[Hermine Strand]

Thanks for giving me the benefit of the doubt. As someone who has his own
website, albeit just a free Wordpress blog, I know all about getting
backlinks from car dealerships and content theft by sites like scoop.it. So
I can understand any skepticism.

I already asked a very basic question because I'm fairly raw and only have
general public knowledge about autism. All links welcome as long as my AV
can handle them :)

Post by Hermine Strand
Not autistic myself, but sympathetic and willing to learn. Research is
important!
--
Hermine Strand
Author

Hello Hermine.

I understand that authors need to research subjects they want to write about
and if that's what you're here to do that's fine by me. Whatever has brought
you here, welcome! I'd encourage you to ask anything you want and join in
the discussions, or start new ones.

Dolphinius
(Male, age 40 +/- a few months, UK, self-diagnosed AS)